Support for CF cards to cater for D-SLR users

[brett maxwell]

Btw it might be the case that sales figures already indicate a total switch to SD, but at least from my perspective I cannot see that coming.

I recall seeing sales figures from Nikon and Canon DSLR models, and the $500-700 cameras completely dominate sales, and they've all switched to SD (a few generations ago, right?). It's really only the professional bodies that remain CF, which represent a small percentage of DSLRs and a tiny percentage of total cameras. And it's easy to see the argument that these users should use the manufacturer supplied solution. Yes, they're expensive, but if the demand is low for a CF Eye-fi (and "low" could be 10k+) the cost of development could mean they would cost nearly as much as the manufacturer solution, which of course then drives demand down even further.

[BillTracy]

But I bet the ratio of people who will buy an Eye-Fi card, even if it was $300, would be higher amongst the professionals.

So should us professionals just forget about Eye-Fi all together?

[worg]

I can't believe this thread has gone on since 2008 and this company still refuses to make a CF card version. WHAT'S THE BIG DEAL????? There are tons of cameras made for CF cards and there always will be. This company is very short-sighted and is missing a huge professional segment of the market who would use it in the field with their ipads. As always, catering to the dummy masses and no help for the ACTUAL photographers out there.

[billsrule7]

Hi,

Let me say that I bought an Eye-fi card today thinking that was an adapter for it to make it CF compatible. Wrong. I'll be taking it back to the store. I should have done more research, but I didn't think that a company would be so short-sighted as to alienate an entire population of camera owners.

You lost a customer today. I'd also like to say that it is a shame that after reading through this thread that the company is so dismissive of CF owners.

[BillTracy]

This is like if a video game producer made their game only available for Nintendo 64, because there's more of them - lol!

[Polansky]

It is indeed strange to see that a company like eye-fi is ignoring an entire group of DSLR users with a weak argument that a CF card would mean an entire chip redevelopment. Which is uterly nonsense as the basic ingredients that are needed already have been proven to work.

That said.
Please explain to us why there are still so many companies that are keen of putting millions of dollars into CF card development as to your company own research there is no future for CF.

Do you really think that companies like SanDisk produces and develop CF cards and are willing so because they think its a lost business? .... Meaby, just meaby, these companies are into the CF card business to make profits?

Its unbelieveable that a company like eye-fi which is a great product by itself, does NOT see the potential of opening a new market with a CF card solution.

I mean, its a bit short sighted to think that a market does not exist while so many people are requesting for this solution.
this market is bigger then you think. Meaby your company just asked the wrong people on which you have based this forecast.

[worg]

Not to worry, a more progressive company will come along to take the business and fill the niche once they see Eye-Fi won't be doing it. On this site Eye-Fi goes out of their way to "heavily caution" people about not using their cards in a CF adapter - that strikes me as so ignorant - people desperate to use their products but no one here cares to make a dedicated card for them.

[BillTracy]

Not to worry, a more progressive company will come along to take the business and fill the niche once they see Eye-Fi won't be doing it.

I truly and sincerely hope so!

[Brokk]

Will there ever be a sollution für Compact Flash users?

[BillTracy]

Will there ever be a sollution für Compact Flash users?

No. Just forget about EyeFi and move on.

[huskyte]

Will there ever be a sollution für Compact Flash users?

Most probably it will be easier to make Canon build a SD drive into a 5D (ccenter@va.ccsi.canon.com) ATM no eye-fi for you or for us... sadly.

[huskyte]

Yesterday I got a new gadget for my iPad (no, it is not an eye-fi card).
Apple had/has more or less the same position to CF as eye-fi. The camera connection kit (CCK) is solely designed for SD-cards or direct USB connection. Despite almost as many outcries as in this thread, Apple refused to offer a direct CF card solution, mainly because of the same reasons we have heard here. Additionally, Apples excuse was the draw of power (which cannot be fully true due to the design specs of SD cards)
Well, through MicGadget I ordered a CF card compatible CCK by a chinese company. Guess what, it works as well as the original CCK, just with CF cards.

Obviously this cannot be taken as a direct comparison as it is probably easier to design a CCK than an CF-eye-fi card. On the other hand the margin is proportionally lower for these little gadgets, but the market share is the same (SD vs. CF). So, I would conclude that if a chinese company goes for a CF CCK development (lower initial investment, lower margin, identical market share) the same could also be true for eye-fi!

[BillTracy]

What is a CCK ? Could you post a link please to this gadget you speak of?

[huskyte]

Well, the only iPads camera connection kit (aka CCK).
The chinese interpretation is http://store.micgadget.com/card-readers ... n-kit.html
Apples original link cannot be posted atm as the store is updating, but I am sure you have heard of it.

[BillTracy]

Wow thanks for the link. I have an iPad II on the way so I'll be ordering one of these right after I post this reply - lol

[huskyte]

Then FYI: This gadget works perfectly well. And I am having quite some experience with the original CCK in combination with USB hubs and CF card readers (iOS3.x and 4.x). In opposite to the flawed Apple part this accepts all cards. I haven't tested them all yet, but the ones which work with the chinese substitute definitely did not work with Apples CCK and iOS4.x.

[ovisopa]

Hello guys,

I'm too interested in using eye-fi in a CF only Body, but instead of asking over and over again for a CF eye-fi without understanding that the CF segment is quite small, and I thing it will get smaller and smaller, Canon switched to SD on the xxD line (I own one 40D and one 50D camera and a few CF cards), and development costs of a new chip it's high ... I suggest someone (maybe staff) creates a new topic with only the interesting info, like bellow:

CF adapter x works on y camera
CF adapter z doesn't work in y camera

This will be much more usefull than arguing over and over, I had to go through all the 5 pages to find out that two people (rycckor and 24Peter) ware actually able to use the eyefi with a CF adapter card, one of them had even the same camera I have.

Samsung , one of the newest Brand entering in DSLR segment, chosed in 2006 to use SDHC cards, Pentax also uses SDHC, Canon xxxD line uses SD cards only (except 350d which has CF), recently Canon xxD line moved to SD card ... so many reasons that the CF cards seems to be less and less used The speed between the two technologies seems to be almost the same, the fastest CF as I know is rated at 100MB/s and the fastest SD 95MB/s

PS. To Eye-fi staff, you have a page about CF adapter compatibility but the link to external website is no longer available

[huskyte]

Well said, but one thing I would like to point out: It is of no interest for most of us what will be future technology or not. What counts is what we already own and that is mainly CF for most of us here. Of course, we have a fluctuation, but owning several bodies in the multithousand dollar range makes me confident that I am still going to be using CF in the next few years.
A point and shoot or a xxxD Eos might be exchanged on a yearly basis, but I guess things are different if you own bodies for 3000$ each. They need to earn your money or investment back.
And by the way Judging from the development of SD I wouldn't be to sure to expect a compatible SD technology in 3-5 years, which makes a constant development necessary for the eye-fi team.

PS: A comprehensive forum/threads are available as you suggested, have a look at the camera section.

Greetz

[m_gou1]

I also found the hard way that CF were not supported ( bought 1st adaptor that did not work, now i've found a different one that works, but randomly crashes and sometimes loses photos on my Rebel XT)

I was thinking that maybe eye.fi could build an adapter instead of a complete CF solution.
The electronics should be simpler...

Instead of trying to transfer raw data from the camera to the sd eye-fi, the adapter card could have build-in standard flash memory, wired to have direct access (DMA) to a simple controller to send it to the SD Eye-fi card.
That way the camera would be always "happy" and see a flash card all the time, and the SD Eye-fi card could then have all the time it needs to read and process the data without interfering with camera functions/access.

From what i can observe, when my Canon camera tries to access the Eye-Fi card though the adapter, and the eye-fi card is processing and/or sending data to wifi, the adapter seems to be caught in a loop, waiting for the eye-fi to respond , which it doesn't, and then stops sending data to the camera... corruption or error 02 follows and i have to reset the camera. Memory sharing (and/or timing and speed) seems to be the problem in the "adaptor" solution.

That's my suggestion to Eye-Fi,
Thanks.
Mig.

[shambuck]

I'm another professional photographer adding his voice to the list of those who would greatly benefit from a CF version of an eye-fi card. While the range could be better, I'm currently working w/ a sd-to-cf adapter and it's working very well when paired w/ my ipad in the field. Art directors love being able to view the images w/o lugging around or being anchored to a laptop, and I do NOT miss the 20-ft tethering cable. Additionally, the ipad battery goes and goes. The whole system is fantastic!
But not all my CF cameras take the larger (type II) adapters and that's a real drag. Switching lenses or saying to the art director, 'you won't be seeing the next few images' is lousy for the way I work.
I believe compact flash cards are here to stay in professional-level cameras, mainly because of their size and durability--when your carreer's relying on such a tiny piece of equipment, it's very comforting knowing it's not going to snap in two or slip through your fingers.
Problem is the market may simply not be there for such a card. The solution? Charge me a premium--$300 is still way cheaper (and the eye-fi solution much more elegant) then Nikon's transmitter.
If eye-fi is to remain the leader (and currently the only member) of the pack, it's in their interest to develop the CF version before someone else does because we all know: photographers who are not professionals really want to be professionals, and they'll spend hours trolling professional sites/blogs to read up on the gear they 'should' own. Once the CF version of an eye-fi (or other company's) card arrives, that company will be THE company talked about on professional sites/blogs for all your CF (& sd) transmitting card solutions.

[y_nk]

Hi there,

I'm a Fuji S5 Pro user, brand new X2 owner but it does not work for me, even with a CF adaptor.
I won't complain about it ; i knew what i was hoping could not work. As a geek, i was not afraid to test, experiment and still searching for a (even complicated) way to make this working. Btw i think it has been discussed for a very long time, so no double posting.

I read all this thread before writing this, but as i'm french and not a very good english reader, i still have some point i don't understand.

Berend, i saw you said that you might have enough data to know if a CF could be great. Would you want me to build a quick'n'dirty php poll and take some emails of the potential buyers, with, let's say, the description 'bowserb' wrote in page 2 ?

My ideal Eye-Fi product would be a Compact Flash version with 16GB udma memory and 802.11n communication, along with the ability to work with popular remote software like Breeze Systems' DSLR Pro. As an advanced amateur, I really don't care about any of the wifi hotspot stuff, automatic uploading to a website, etc. Shooting RAW, my files are 18-22GB each. I want them in the computer ASAP. Price point? I see $200 to $250 as OK

Or maybe it's a technological issue ? If so, i can see why you're saying that you're not recommanding CF adapters.

I may understand that a line drawn at the door of your business doesn't allow you to give people third party solutions. (I think you did, but) did you consider that giving people a third party solution with saying "we know that people tried this technique with this DSLR but we really don't recommand that and it'll make warranty void" would change the way customers are currently seeing that cold sentence "no CF adapter at all" ?

I guess always saying the same things are (a bit) annoying (in my job i do it ALL the day). That's why i'm trying to ask new questions. I hope people will read all the topic before posting a lame "my CF DSLR camera don't work this is a shit" answer, and consider the hole problem before

[Triggaaar]

Another lost customer here. I'd love to buy a CF Eye-Fi

[REBogart]

I agree, it is a wise decision to include the CF users. Besides, if you don't do it someone else will and they will get all the money and you will lose a worthwhile business opportunity since you already possess the technology.... I wouldn't give it a second thought if it were me. It would already be headed for production. Take a poll just to get a starting figure and see where it takes you. Good luck and I'll be waiting.

Regards,

Richard

[BM27]

I also would like to see this technology placed in a CF card.

While I understand how costly new technology can be, it should be noted that SanDisk has already created a CF card with wireless network capability. This card was not designed for camera use, only for pc memory, but it's obviously quite possible.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0301/03010 ... skwifi.asp

Another example to bring up beyond apple is Boeing aircraft. They went around buying up every US aircraft company many years ago, but were blocked from purchasing Lockheed-Martin because it would have left Boeing without competition. In truth, that didn't matter because lockheed's most popular passenger airliner, the L10-11 used technology patented by Boeing. Boeing created the s-duct exhaust system Lockheed used although they never implemented it themselves.

If Eye-Fi cated the basic technology for this card and patented it, they could then license that patent to someone else who has the ability to support it and as a result make even more money. Think about how much money the guy who invented the coffee-collar gets from Starbucks every year!

There are creative ways to make this work for everyone.

Personally I would even be willing to have an 8 GB card that had WLAN only and didn't upload to flickr or other sites right away. I think most artistic and professional photographers would be happy to just be able to wirelessly tether since we generally don't post images we haven't touched up. Having the ability to review the image on a computer or iPad without the extra wires would be a huge plus.

[flyingember]

I would pay to buy an approved adapter that doesn't cause photo loss.

[mrowell]

+1 to this. I would definitely invest in a CF card if they had that option.

[Rogier Bos]

Dear Berend,

Like many on this thread, I would like to express my desire for a CF-version of your Pro X2 product. As a Pro Photographer and Nikon D700 user, I am currently unable to use your products at all.

I have a number of your replies in this thread and appreciated the answers you have given to different posters, and the honesty displayed in your answers. I understand your perception that the CF market is not that large and maybe decreasing in size.

What I am missing, however, is a vision. One of these days some company, somewhere, is going to realize that the tremendous opportunity in providing a solution that will allow photographers to have images transferred wirelessly to an iPad or other tablet, a laptop or work-station, or straight to a video-projector. The company that realizes that is going to make a fortune!

My clients would KILL for the opportunity to see my images in more detail then they currently can on the back of my screen. Imagine my client, or his art-director, holding my iPad while I shoot his project — and being able to give me directions. Or imagine me, working a corporate event, where my images are displayed on a massive screen above my head, or sent straight away to Flickr, a blog, etc... My clients would love that and pay handsomely for that — and before long it would be the standard in corporate photography. In the not-so-distant future every single pro photographer (on whatever level of professionalism) will want to display his images on a tablet a small distance away from the camera. I'm convinced of this — it's the way things are going to develop. The only question, who will create this solution first?

As I said, whoever realizes this first, and can get there first, can carve out a nice niche for themselves. Maybe Nikon/Canon will create onboard Wifi? Maybe OnOne software, or Photodispatch.nl? Or maybe EyeFi... It seems you are ready to meet this need.

I don't know how technologically complex it is (though, if you can do it on an SD card, how hard can it be on a CF card?). But if you believe the market may be too small, I think you are missing a gigantic opportunity!

Warm regards, greetings from Holland

Rogier Bos

[pjagur]

I'm using an EYE-FI Pro X2 with a Extreme MMC, SDHC, SD to CF Type II Adapter so it can fit into a Caon 5D MKII.

It worked great when I tested off line (out of my regular workflow) it took several months to work it in (find a real use to benifit my customers) and I ran using it for two weeks.

When I started the third week I took my shots (a high speed burst of 3 or 4) walked over towards my camera table and started to review the shots to tag them for uplaod. The camera presented an out of order image and a strange warning regarding operations in progress. Turns out instead of writting a frame a second (normal) it was taking more like 4 seconds a frame for the camera to write to the card.

Putting in a std. CF card yields a normal write speed. Putting the adapted EYE-FI Pro X2 back in and I hit the slow down again. The wi-fi functionality appears to be normal and tagged file still upload.

The ESDCFII: Extreme MMC, SDHC, SD to CF Type II Adapter is is the recommended adapter from a DPreview forum, however I did pull the protective metal covers to free up a path for the Wi-Fi RF signal.

Anyone seeing similar slow downs? Solutions?

[tttedzeins]

I would also love CF card support. I tried an adapter with my Explore x2, it did not work so the card sits on my desk and does not get used until I borrow a camera that takes SD cards.

Initial price is not an issue for me as I would support it just to get one.

[jamez]

Another Professional photographer requesting CF format. I've just started using the B&H adapter with 4Gb X2 Connect on a D3.

I'd pay a premium to get it as well. Just think of what can be done with the extra space if they can shove all that goodness into the space of an SD card. Perhaps they could boost the signal!

It boggles the mind to see a company doing alright and not taking the 'risk' to cater to a professional market. Let's hope that they're using the masses to create a stable product that they'll bring out to the professionals (in CF format) soon.